Spin Sucks Logo
Jan 26
2012
Gini Dietrich

How Do You Know When It’s Time to Fire a Client?

Yes, I know it’s Facebook question of the week time, but we’re trying something new this week.

You see, Social Fresh wrote last week about the best times of the week and day to blog, in order to get social shares.

Historically, Mondays and Tuesdays on Spin Sucks are our big days, but the Social Fresh research proves we might be missing something on Thursdays.

I’m curious to see if a blog post runs at 8 a.m. and the video runs at noon, if there is a difference both in traffic and social shares.

So Lisa Gerber has answered Barry Silver’s Facebook question and that will run at noon.

This morning, however, you get an intellectual discussion about when to determine it’s time to fire a client.

A Story

In late 2010, a friend called me and said he had the next big idea and was interested in working with us.

Having learned my lesson with this particular friend in the past, I refused to do any work or put anyone from my team on his business until he signed a contract and sent us a deposit.

He did.

And we got to work early last year. You see, his business was a me-too product in the daily deal space, but we were really excited about how they were building to differentiate themselves. We thought we had some great ideas for building some Groupon competition in Chicago.

And then…

In the very first meeting with our combined teams, he looked at my team and said, “Don’t screw this up or I’ll fire you.”

Whoa! Way to motivate!

My team was a little taken aback, but instead of listening to the red flags in my mind, I pushed forward and rebuilt everyone’s confidence to do some good work.

The meetings didn’t get much better. In some cases, he’d schedule meetings and not show up. In other cases, he’d have his right-hand person read us the riot act. On work that we hadn’t had enough time to complete.

This went on for the first month. We sent our second invoice.

Going into the fifth week of working with them, the Chicago Tribune wrote a story on the 40+ (!!!) daily deal sites in Chicago alone.

And our client was not included in the story.

To say I was yelled at is being nice. I’ve never had anyone, let alone a client, speak to me the way he did. I’ve never had someone use so much profanity in delivering a message. I had to tell him to call me back when he calmed down and I hung up the phone.

The funny thing? The client’s site wasn’t yet launched. Heck, it wasn’t even designed yet. So for us to have gotten them included in that story would have been nothing short of a miracle. Not to mention, we don’t typically pitch round-up stories like that for our clients, especially when there are 40 other businesses to compete with in 800 words.

I explained both points, but he didn’t care. There was no reasoning with him. Even the proposal we’d agreed on, just five weeks earlier, didn’t have a media relations component.

At that point, he and I agreed to go our separate ways and he never paid our second invoice, even though we’d done double the work he’d already paid for and, because of his 24/7 needs, I’d pulled nearly my entire team onto the account.

It hurt us fiscally. Badly. When I had our attorney send a letter, he responded by saying, “I’m not paying this invoice and, if you pursue it, I’ll have you and your business ruined. I’m very well-connected in Chicago and it won’t be hard to do.”

The Lesson

His response made me want to fight. I’m pretty sure I would have spent every penny we had fighting him. I would have let him put us out of business just to prove I was right.

I like to be right. And he treated us really poorly. I needed my team to see I was willing to fight for them.

My attorney was a bit more calm than me. We had a discussion about strategy and what it would take (both money and time) to fight to get the invoice paid. It would have ended up costing us more than double what he owed us. And he owed us a lot of money.

So I let it drop…as much as it still pains me to do so.

The moral of the lesson is you should always listen to your gut.

After that very first meeting, when I had all those red flags practically jumping out at me, I should have fired him.

It would have saved us a lot of time, a huge write-off, and my team’s morale.

Special thanks to Bourn Creative for the image.

Do you like this post? Subscribe to Spin Sucks
If you like this post, why not share it!
Post comment as twitter logo facebook logo
Sort: Newest | Oldest
Panorama Stitching 6 pts

one of the most diffucult-est part in business is to fire a client! have had bad experiences as well.

bryanwillmert 14 pts

Boy oh boy does that ring very familiar for me right now. Thanks for sharing that Gini!! The pain of that sucks but i am sure the pain of going further would have been much worse! I appreciate your candid conversation!

My latest conversation: Product Placement

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

bryanwillmert I thought you'd like this one.

My latest conversation: Stuck In a Rut? Pivot Your Business.

JanetAronica 24 pts

Just wanted to say thanks for linking to the blog timing post over here :)

- Janet from Shareaholic

My latest conversation: 10 Shareable Content Tips to Kickstart Your Week

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

JanetAronica You bet, Janet! We're testing the theory about Thursdays. I'll have some results to share in a month.

My latest conversation: Stuck In a Rut? Pivot Your Business.

rdopping 72 pts

Wow! That's a terrible situation. I suppose the friend is not a friend anymore. It's so, so hard for me to say no to a friend. I can't do it easily but I never really had a situation quite as bad as yours. I got caught in a friend/work relationship a few years ago and even though I got paid it cost me 3 times in time than what the job was worth. I had to finish it, didn't I? Yuk. Suffice it to say I have a hard time continuing to call someone a friend if they do that to you.

Good lesson learned for me. I won't take work from "friends" anymore instead recommend another designer to work with them. When a client becomes a friend (as they so often do) there is usually still a buffer of the original professional relationship there that you can always fall back on if it starts to go south. Too bad if it does but hey, we are all "big boys", so to speak.

Thanks for sharing (and reminding me of my story).

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

rdopping Yes, I too have the working with friends policy now.

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

dariasteigman 27 pts

Hi Gini,

Thanks for sharing this story. I think too often people are afraid to say no to business (it's not always fun, especially in lean times)--but I've found I'm always better off long term trusting my instincts. When I don't, I need up pretty miserable. And these are always clients that no one (at least me) can make happy.

Love the charitable use of the word "friend" in describing the start of dealing #2 (or #3?) with this client.

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

dariasteigman You're so right. The money might be good at the start, but it ends up costing you a lot more in the long run.

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

rachaelseda 295 pts

Wow what a powerful lesson. Thanks for sharing and being so candid. We all make mistakes but as long as you learn from it it's ok. Listening to my gut instinct has been something my Mom has ingrained in me since I was a child...I remember you giving me the same advice as well. It's always nice to be reminded!

Um and I hope you're not still friends with this d-bag..

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

rachaelseda Uh no. I'm pretty sure, after the blowout, he has zero desire to be friends with me, either.

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

Nic_Cartwright 56 pts

Woaw... some friend...!!

How is this mate's company doing now??? The laws of Karma dictate that they were bought out by a larger/more honorable company than them (Enron?) before being stitched up on the sale price ("Dollars?? No we said - 1 million Lira"). Cue expensive legal battle resulting in loss of personal wealth and a life scouring the multitude of Chicago Discount offers for a cut price lawyer...

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

Nic_Cartwright I'd be lying if I said we don't look to see if they're doing business yet (they're not). Karma, as they say, comes around.

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

Nikki Little 54 pts

I had one of those "should have listened to my gut" moments during my first internship at a PR agency, and I will NEVER not pay attention to red flags again. It was a horrible and demoralizing experience, and I'm kind of surprised I pursued a PR career after the hell the agency owner put me and the other interns through. But, I learned a lot of lessons from it and am now a better/stronger person. But yes...never ignore the red flags.

Thanks for sharing this story. Hopefully it pops into someone's head the next time they're in a red flag situation.

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

Nikki Little Wow. It wasn't a client...it was the boss?

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

Nikki Little 54 pts

ginidietrich Yup, it was the boss. I haven't had any atrocious client experiences (yet).

SociallyGenius 102 pts

Firing Clients is necessary sometimes - especially when you value your time and are in high demand. Not everyone is in the position to be picky, but it's certainly ideal when you can choose who you work with. Very good topic and story - I'm sure you won't hesitate to Trump the next jackass that raises your flags!

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

SociallyGenius We'll see if I learned my lesson or not. I hope so!

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

TomMartin 10 pts

Gini

Great reminder -- every time I've ignored that little voice I've regretted it in some way. Funny how out Spidey Sense is so well trained eh?

TomMartin

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

TomMartin It is funny, isn't it? I had a business advisor who used to say, "Don't just trust your gut, obey it."

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

Shelley Pringle 71 pts

Boy, can I relate to your story. My gut told me something was wrong when a client balked at signing a contract. They then insisted on including a quote from a well known rock star in a news release, even though we didn't have his permission--talk about unethical! It got worse when they wouldn't pay their bills and then threatened to counter sue ME if I pursued any legal action. Fortunately I was able to take them to small claims court (not very expensive) and get at least part of the money they owed me. In hindsight I should have insisted on all my money upfront. I know it's childish, but half-way through my engagement with them I added their phone number to my directory so it displayed "F**k Wits" whenever they called me.

My latest conversation: Is communication shipwrecked at cruise lines?

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

Shelley Pringle LMAO!!! That is hilarious!!

My latest conversation: Gin and Topics: #McFail, Chobani, and Social Media

Lisa Gerber 908 pts

I remember the elevator ride down after that first meeting. We both looked at each other: "Don't screw this up!"

Oh, OK. Because we were totally going to, so thanks for being clear.

That was the moment right there - and we've used that as a lesson more than once; to follow instinct. You finally blogged about it. :)

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

Lisa Gerber I loved how you kept saying, "Man! I wish I'd said, 'Yeah. Because that's how we start client relationships...by screwing up!'" HAHAHAHA!

My latest conversation: Who's the Real Loser In Social Search?

belllindsay 186 pts

ginidietrichLisa Gerber Had I been there (with my big, inappropriate mouth) I probably *would* have! LMAO!

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

belllindsayLisa Gerber Now THAT I'm pretty sure we both would have paid to see!

My latest conversation: Who's the Real Loser In Social Search?

DannyBrown 2757 pts

ginidietrichbelllindsayLisa Gerber Oh my! This alert came through on my phone and I thought you said "PEED to see!"!!! :)

My latest conversation: The Trade and the Tools of Social CRM

belllindsay 186 pts

DannyBrownginidietrichLisa Gerber That too! LOL

Karl Sly 5 pts

This post reminds me of kind hearted client I'm currently working with now, but I have to say your client sounds a bit more friendlier then mine. People like this deserve success in seeing their energy magnified and returned to their own business.Consider your time spent an investment, you'll never hear from him again. That's probably worth a lot more then what he owes you.

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

Karl Sly Aren't these kind-hearted clients awesome?!?

My latest conversation: Who's the Real Loser In Social Search?

belllindsay 186 pts

Karl Sly And every client is now saying to themselves "Er.....?" - LOL :)

wagnerwrites 21 pts

I was also reminded of the fact that sooner or later in the PR business, the contacts you depend on in the media and elsewhere will come to know that you are working with a complete A-hole. That hurts the brand. Thanks for the very timely moral lesson!

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

wagnerwrites You know what? That is a GREAT point!

My latest conversation: Who's the Real Loser In Social Search?

SocialMediaDDS 531 pts

wagnerwrites I like that viewpoint. Sometimes, no matter what business we are in, we get so focused on the narrow picture that we forget to see how our choices will impact the bigger picture...how others will see us based on our choices and how that does, indeed, affect the perception of the brand as a whole. Excellent to remember for all of us!! Lisa Gerber belllindsay

SFMichele57 5 pts

Wow! Brings back (not happy) memories: I experienced a similar, "highly motivational" welcome from a new employer on my first day during the "here's the file cabinet, this is the front door key" orientation. And, as this was during our still-ongoing Great Recession and I was so glad to have a job, I optimistically forged onward. Never again. When they come right out at the outset and definitely tell you -- as they did in your case and in mine -- in a few words or with a speech that they don't *really* want to work **with** you, you must believe it, get up, leave the office, and not look back.

ginidietrich 5360 pts moderator

SFMichele57 Was it our client?? LOL! Man! Doesn't it make you angry that you didn't pack up and leave? I guess we think, "Ah surely that was a joke. I mean, it's my first day." I'm really sorry that happened to you. Some people really suck.

My latest conversation: Who's the Real Loser In Social Search?

Conversation from Twitter

ginidietrich
ginidietrich

lizstrauss No. Not fun at all.

prosperitygal
prosperitygal

lizstrauss oh god yes, firing client is angst driving cc@ginidietrich

ginidietrich
ginidietrich

EnMastBusiness Some people suck, huh?

EnMastBusiness
EnMastBusiness

ginidietrich Better to just let those people go than to even worry about how much they suck.

ginidietrich
ginidietrich

EnMastBusiness Very true

JessicaNorthey
JessicaNorthey

redheadwriting ginidietrich hey hey! two of my favorite CyberCheekas in one tweet :)

Carmen_Benitez_
Carmen_Benitez_

paulepetersen ginidietrich rocks. Love her to bits. Glad to see you following her. A very smart lady w/stellar team.

humansCher
humansCher

carmen_benitez_ No one can watch it for more than 10 seconds ----> http://t.co/IQQXlymJ

ginidietrich
ginidietrich

carmen_benitez_ xoxo

KDillabough
KDillabough

socialmediadds ginidietrich :))))))

KyEkinci
KyEkinci

ginidietrich ..one knows, I've done that twice this year.

ensino
ensino

ginidietrich great, yet sad story. I have always followed my gut = success.

ginidietrich
ginidietrich

ensino I wish I could say the same

Trackbacks

  1. [...] When It’s Time to Fire the Client by @ginidietrich via @spinsucks: [...]

Web Analytics