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Facebook Does Not Mean Private
It’s Facebook question of the week time and, because I did a video on Tuesday, you get prose today instead.
Well, that and I’m lazy again this morning. I still need to ride so no video for you!
Nancy Davis is an avid Spin Sucks reader and one of the sane commenters in a sea of crazies (myself included). She works and lives in Jersey and, I know this not because it’s on her blog (it is), but because we were joking about her showing up in a tracksuit to help me beat some of you down for not leaving questions on the Arment Dietrich Facebook wall.
I’d be scared, if I were you! So head over there and leave a question. The last thing you want is the both of us threatening to break your knees.
She asks…
I have a question for you – I have a boss who is on Facebook. He is into some “edgy” stuff. The things he “likes” on Facebook are not things I think clients should know about him. I have mentioned to him that anything he “likes” is public, and have gone to my other bosses and no one is doing anything. How can I deal with this? This has the potential to lose clients, especially if they see the questionable (porn related) things one of my bosses “likes.” Please help me!
Some of you may have heard me to tell this story, so hang with me. I think it’ll help Nancy.
Two years ago, this Memorial Day, we were in Beaver Creek with our good friends Harry and Erin Brumleve. The boys were enjoying the Blues, Brews, and BBQ festival and the girls were spending the day hiking.
We finished our hike and went to have a glass of wine.
If you’ve ever hiked in the mountains, in altitude, you know your adrenaline is pumping, your endorphines are going, and the air is thin. So one glass of wine + all of that = silliness.
Well, Erin LOVES Keanu Reeves (actually, loved; now she LOVES Russell Brand) and it’s really fun to tease her about his being gay. She gets all defensive and worked up and it’s really funny to watch.
So, this particular trip, we were teasing her and, now I don’t remember what the bet was, but she had a bet with Mr. D that if she lost, she’d have to put on Facebook that she finally admits that she can never have him (as if she could if he were straight).
And I tweeted something to the effect of, “If @erinbrumleve loses a bet, she has to admit Keanu Reeves is gay.” Or something stupid like that.
Well, we were about a signature away from closing a new piece of business and the client saw that tweet.
And he read it as my being homophobic.
And he refused to sign the contract.
So we lost that business. All because of a joke and a stupid tweet.
So, Nancy, that’s my long way of telling you that you can and will lose business because of the way your boss behaves on Facebook.
My guess is porn-related stuff is likely much worse than what I did.
I wish I had some magical thing you could say that would make him stop.
It’s not an easy thing to do, and it’s easy for me to say sitting 1,000 miles away, but I think you have to be pretty upfront with him about it. “Boss-man, when you like porn-related things on Facebook, clients and prospects aren’t going to want to work with us.”
Likely he thinks it’s all private and no one sees it. You could even prove that it’s out there for people to see, if he fights you on it.
Or perhaps you can share this blog post with him. Or maybe it will take not getting (or losing) some business before he gets it.
What do you guys think?
Even if your profile is 100% private. Mark Zuckerberg has the right to use and sell everything you have on your profile for a profit. It is in the T&C. That is why I never upload pics anymore and really just use Facebook for little chit chats with friends. Completely lost all its value to me as a communication platform. And from what people outside our industry have been telling me for many many more people.
HowieSPM Yeah! What <---- said!
This is exactly the reason Facebook is bad for your health - and your business in this case. I cannot even imagine being Nancy and having to ask this question in the first place! Wow! I dont think I could look at my co-worker, let alone my boss, if I saw them liking 'porno' content on a daily basis. Yikes! Find a new job? How do you have a conversation like that? Clearly she has tried as indicated in her question there. One thing she could do is leave a comment on the like which will get it more attention. May be bad in the short run but will teach him a lesson of sorts. This is just SO bad, I dont even know what to say.
C_Pappas I guess she brought it up again, after this, and was told they can like anything they like on Facebook. So I told her she should ask if he would be embarrassed to have a client find his porn magazines on his desk. Maybe THEN he'd get it.
ginidietrich That is SO bad!!! And Im not so sure he would get it if he hasnt already. Who is this person?!? Very strange!
Wow Gini - you surely had to learn the hard lesson there. Was it homophobic - "no". Because what if you said "you have to admit he's hetro" - no offense would have been taken. But I guess there are certain sensitivies that we have to pay attention to...it sucks (as does spin) when we're in it for innocent fun - but I guess some topics generate a high level of offense. Personally, I though it was funny!
I don't use FB so I can't say too much about it. But think the boss-man needs to come down to reality and realize he can't just put stuff out there and think that there's no consequence to his actions. Or, he may face a similar situation as you had to endure. Which sucks!
Happy Friday folks!
Jk Allen I personally thought it was funny, too. But alas! He and I never clicked (though he did with my team) so he likely was looking for a reason to not like me. It still was a very valuable lesson.
Ah Gini, I remember that fateful day. I also remember another time in Las Vegas where you thankfully took my phone away from me to prevent some 'Drunk Tweeting'. I owe you for that btw. And then I remember last July where I deleted my original Twitter account, that had grown to about 3000 followers, because I was paranoid about how I might be perceived, actually how I might be judged, from my Tweets due to a court case that I was involved in at the time for my job. I've since started a new Twitter account but with about 1/3 of the followers I had previously. I'm a psychotherapist, a shrink, talk about having to be PC and sensitive all the time, not to mention being mindful of client confidentiality !! Sometimes I wish I could use my FB or Twitter account to blow off steam or share my bawdy Irish humor with the world, - and I do a little, but not a lot, because, really, as you so eloquently pointed out, such is not the purpose social media outlet. My Facebook relationships are not homogeneous. So while it's okay for me to share a raucous joke with my buddies over a few glasses of wine, it would be a huge faux pas for me to the same when lunching with a colleague or attending a professional training. If I were to blast my FB followers with a comment, a "like", or something else "on the edge" as Nancy puts it, basically I'm demonstrating a lack of regard for the different kinds of relationships I have on Facebook. On Facebook, not only am I THE FUNNIEST FRIEND YOU HAVE, but I'm also a daughter, a wife, someone from high school you haven't talked to in forever, the President of a professional organization, and a colleague to whom you might potentially refer clients. So, like Gini, I try to follow the mantra of good behavior and try to make sure when I am freakin' hilarious it's something that my Grandpa would laugh at too. Oh and by the way, USHER has replaced RUSSELL and KEANU ;0
DenverArtTX WHOA! Usher what?! Finally I agree with your taste! He's smokin' hot. And you made me laugh so hard just now, I snorted. Glad no one is in my office!
Drunk Tweeting! How funny.
I too used FB for only good friends and would be more liberal when i posted. But then as my numbers grew, was fairly conservative despite having a personal FB page and a fanpage for the website.
Last week, I put up a fashion police photo on my personal FB page. I am sorry to say if you dress like a fuscia big bird (no lie) then you are open to be poked fun at. Ok, I am being insensitive again... At any rate a woman who I thought was a friend went to town scolding my choice on MY Page. I took the photo down (mind you it was neck down photo) The woman was right in regard to the country we are in is small. But she was very self righteous about it. Lesson learned. I have thought about reducing my "friends" down to my 50 so I can share my private thoughts with.
Bosses into porn? He would be strongly reprimanded or fired in my industry no doubt. You can't control actions of others but the memo sounds like a great idea.
And Gini, sorry to hear that on the tweeting. Probably not the client you wanted.
Keep up the fun!
Rajka
ExpatDoctorMom So I guess I should take down the photo of the homeless guy I saw walking down the street with his pants down?! I get it's a small world, but at the same time, I agree that a woman dressed as a fuscia big bird deserves to be made fun of. People are funny.
Gosh Gini, it just seems like we can't win! Either the boss is all, "Facebook what?", or else he's clicking the "like" button with feverish wild abandon. :P
Jokes aside, and kind of off topic -- it bothers me a little that I have to watch what I say everywhere. Not that I make it a habit of "drinking and tweeting" or being offensive, but simply because the purpose of social media has been kinda hijacked. If I can't share what I like on Facebook among friends, or drop some sarcasm or a joke without worrying that that school might reject my application, or that job might throw my resume in the trash, or that client might not sign the contract....argh!
When we live in a world where everyone can be "internet famous" in their own little corner, I guess that means we get to experience what was previously reserved for royalty and Hollywood -- no privacy and constant scrutiny and judgement.
Verilliance HAHAHAHAHA! LOL!!!
My feeling on this is that I'm never inappropriate (not after the gay tweet, anyway), I rarely swear, and I never say anything I wouldn't want my grandpa to see. If, after all that, someone is offended, we likely wouldn't make it in any kind of relationship anyway. So I'm happy to have social media to do my first two levels of qualifying so I don't have to spend my own time doing it.
No need to drop the sarcasm or not joke...IMO.
ginidietrich I think I laughed even harder than you when I suddenly got an image of different Facebook cartoon bosses. "Which Facebook boss is yours?"
Honestly, I think that anyone with even half a brain should realize that it's just common sense that absolutely nothing on the internet is truly private. If you put it out there, anyone can and will read it, and form their own judgments--which is not to say that you shouldn't express who you are on your social networking profiles, but one always has to be mindful of what is appropriate. The fact is, clients and potential employers are looking more and more to sites such as Facebook and Twitter when making hiring decisions (especially in the communications industry), so we have to adjust our social networking behaviour to fit into this new reality. Bottom line, I never put anything online that I wouldn't want a potential employer to see!
ChristinaPeden I wonder if there is a difference in the generations, too? You and I know that it's crazy to think it might be private, but I'd be willing to bet this guy is a Baby Boomer and has no idea.
ginidietrich ChristinaPeden I'm willing to go in on that bet.
ginidietrich Yep, that's definitely a fair point. I guess members of the older (and I certainly don't mean that in a disrespectful way!) generation may not realize how far reaching the influence of social media has become, and that you have to moderate your online behaviour appropriately.
I think this really illustrates a very important point! I work with high schoolers all day long and we have to remember, we are not kids... our jobs can be at stake! For those working in social media it is so important to remember that our "social networks" are not just for fun, but for business.
gograhamgo And high schoolers should understand, too, that what they put online now could potentially be used when they go to find a job in four or five years.
When a person is unwilling to see that their actions are potentially harmful to business relationships, it is likely that they may never get it. While there's a chance that somebody may be able to convince this person into having a deeper look into their actions, and perhaps even an epiphany, the likelihood of that occurring is slim. And, too bad, because the world would be a far more peaceful place if more people looked introspectively at their actions, and realized how their actions are affecting others around them.
DHLasker It's like you're in my head. I've been thinking A LOT lately about how selfish we are, as human beings, and how it's getting worse with our instant gratification society. No one thinks beyond their own sphere and it's a pretty interesting philosophical study. I could not agree more on your point about being introspective.
ginidietrich It's the subliminal messages I emit. :) I agree and am disappointed that selfishness seems to be more prevalent than ever before. From chivalry and disregard of acknowledging acts of chivalry, to a lack of interest in other peeps. That said, I am so pleasantly surprised with the peeps I've recently encountered at Social Media events, and on Twitter, in general. It's refreshingly delightful.
Where do we learn to be introspective, to be courteous, to be genuine, to be empathetic?
How does one know they are exhibiting a lack of introspection if they are clueless to its existence, and are never shown, or never see how powerful and rewarding (yeah, yeah, and often painful too) introspection can be?
And now, back to our regular programming.
I think it would be awesome if schools opened our eyes to not only making the grade, buuuuuuut, also (no, scratch that) I think it would be awesome if schools opened our eyes to making the grade AND also to being human.
P.S. Unlike Facebook, I am unable to "Like" my own posts here. :D
DHLasker Here. I'll like it for you.
Hey Gini. So, do you think the client was going to pull out of the deal and had user the homophobic tweet as an excuse? Or was the tweet the real reason?
Also, I think Nancy should lighten up :-)
dino_dogan I'm pretty sure he was looking for a reason. And they eventually went out of business. So it saved us a good deal of loss. But it's still important to remember...don't drink and tweet.
Facebook changes their privacy settings on a weekly basis and that impacts our settings. Ok, they don't change that frequently but they have had a habit of doing so without providing much notification.
Part of what makes me crazy about Facebook is that our friends post things without thinking about how it can impact us. A dear friend from college posted two pictures of me that made me run around like my hair was on fire.
The first was one from our freshman year. In business terms you would say that I was inebriated and that is being kind. Even though it is a quarter of a century ago, I don't want that picture out there because without context it could be problematic.
I untagged it so that it was no longer tied to me and asked him to pull it down. But it still makes me a little crazy. Although I am more irritated about having to be concerned about perception and its impact upon my life.
I talk to my kids often about being cautious about what they write, post or upload because the echoes of the past reach into the future.
TheJackB Thank you. It's not just us.. it's anyone who can tag, comment or post about us. Then their friends can read, share, and so on. And then what our friends like and share about themselves, others can see that too. It's not that I'm hiding exactly, just protective of my privacy and on FB... not sure I'll ever be comfortable with what they consider my user controls. FWIW.
3HatsComm TheJackB I'm in agreement here, too. We all have different boundaries and, to DHLasker point, we need to think about how our actions affect others.
Why don't you just talk to HR and suggest they send out a memo on social networking in your private life and how it affects your business life. After he reads, it mention the porn stuff as an example. If you don't want to involve HR (but it sounds like you probably should because if this an issue there are probably other issues too) you could always go find an article on this topic and write a note on it about the porn and leave it on his desk...even anonymously.
kittymau Didn't think of that, what are the company's SM policies, do they have a social media policy for employees?
3HatsComm kittymau that is part of the problem. We are a small startup, and there are only four of us. Yes I have three bosses and I am the only employee. Shoot me please.
"Don't be a moron" is clearly not enough of a social media policy. God help me, I may have to write one.
Wait, if I work on this for say, an hour, can I take a week off?
3HatsComm kittymau I just remembered I wrote guides to Facebook and Twitter, and I highlight that anything you "like" can be seen by anyone.
For all of that work that no one read, I deserve TWO weeks off!
NancyD68 3HatsComm kittymau I think you deserve two weeks off!
ginidietrich NancyD68 3HatsComm kittymau Two weeks, and a job where you like your bosses because they are respectful to the business and to your concerns.
One of my favorite bands is named the New P**nographers.
I love the band but hate the name. I never want my name and any form of that "P" word showing up in a search together. So when referring to them online or in emails I usually just call them the NP's. Call me paranoid, but I think you have to take precautions like this so you don't end up losing the client, job, girl, etc.
KyleAkerman It is extremelly difficult to look up any info about them or even have a conversation about them because of the name, but it's truly worth it as the are THAT glorious.
M_Koehler KyleAkerman HAHHAHA! I wonder how the corporate firewalls deal with that?!
ginidietrich KyleAkerman Umm, they do not handle it very well. Nor did Kelly the first time I tried to explain who's concert I was going to. When she heard Neko Case was part of the band, well, that didn't help. Neko Case + anything with the word porn = WHOA
M_Koehler ginidietrich I can't wear one of their shirts for fear of what strangers would think.
And I once left a phone message with someone: "Tell Chris I have an extra ticket to New P**nographers tonight." After 5 seconds of awkward silence on other end I added "it's a band. No really, I'm not a perv."
Why couldn't they have chosen a different name??? BTW love me some Neko Case!
Clueless bosses haven't changed; only the venue has changed. If that boss is socially challenged enough to post inappropriate things on Facebook that are visible to the world, then he's the same guy that 15 yrs ago would have slapped his secretary on the rear end for a job well done. Eventually Darwin's Law will kick in and he won't be a boss anymore.
rosemaryoneill Ha! Great point!
Sane commenters? I thought the internet was only good for porn and twitter............
Think she asked boss man "have you washed those hands"?..............Just sayin'.................
You should count on NOTHING being private on the internet; whatever persona you want to project can be attributed to who you hang with and the comments you make.
If it's a personal acct I don't know if you can say anything other than it's repulsive and you are an idiot; otherwise, it could very well be an HR issue.............especially if it is affecting the reputation of the firm.
Final thought; you are actually trying to sell that altitude and wine made you silly? Like me, you just can't help it at times and I can't say it has cost me a deal but I would be lyin' if I said I hadn't stepped on it before.
Been missin' me? My payin' gig is keeping me hopping which is a good thing.
bdorman264 Um, I weigh 110 pounds. A glass of wine is like three or four to most people. So yeah...I was buzzed and being silly!
I have been missing you here. But I get daily emails from you so these guys may be missing you more!
ginidietrich bdorman264 Daily emails- I feel so left out. ;)
TheJackB bdorman264 Bill, you'd better send Jack daily emails, too.
ginidietrich TheJackB If it will make him feel better....
e-mails are so 'old school' aren't they; has anyone seen my fax paper.....
This is a great example of transparency gone way wrong. I mean come on....you gotta draw the line some where.
Here's my take on the dude:
1. He doesn't give a rip about what other people see, which means he's socially inept
or
2. He doesn't know that everyone sees that stuff....which means he's socially inept.
skywardjason Hey Jason; socially inept is probably the accurate description.
skywardjason So you think he's socially inept?
[...] make you uncomfortable. There was an interesting discussion on Gini Dietrich’s blog regarding Facebook and privacy. Dietrich shares a story about an unfortunate tweet she sent that ended up costing her new [...]